Cooking For Engineers

Jim Cooley · Joined: 09 Oct 2008 Posts: 377 Location: Seattle

Anyone ever use lard instead of shortening for pie dough? How's the flavor? (We're talking fruit pies, not savory pies)

My stomach does NOT like Crisco. I've tried all butter, but the crust is a little tough, not to mention expensive!

I usually use use half butter, half shortening.

Dilbert · Joined: 19 Oct 2007 Posts: 1307 Location: central PA

the issue is stickier than you may have thought . . .

half butter + half (something else) is my usual approach.

in the transfat massacre, Crisco changed it's formula.
rather more than a few bakers have noticed a major problem using "new" Crisco in "classic" recipes.

lard is good.

DrBiggles · Joined: 12 May 2005 Posts: 356 Location: Richmond, CA

IronRinger · Joined: 23 Nov 2011 Posts: 19

I come from a long line of lard pastry makers. Until I started reading cooking fora on the net, I had NEVER heard of using butter for pie crust. Mind you, here in Canada, we can still get unhydrogenated lard, cheap, in any supermarket. And I think our Crisco is still laced with trans fat. So it is lard all the way, all the time for me.

Jim Cooley · Joined: 09 Oct 2008 Posts: 377 Location: Seattle

Thanks guys. I'll get some lard (Armor, I think -- manteca) and give it a go.

It's the Palm oil in the new, improved Crisco that throws my stomach for a loop. I don't recall the old stuff ever causing such a problem.

Spare me the do-gooders!

Michael Chu · Joined: 10 May 2005 Posts: 1654 Location: Austin, TX (USA)

Jim Cooley · Joined: 09 Oct 2008 Posts: 377 Location: Seattle

Michael, you're right! Armor Manteca/Lard works fine, but has a really OFF flavor.

Tastes like a diner pie -- not bad, but not especially good.

I'll look for baker's leaf lard. Got any suggestions where to find it? I don't know any good bakeries in the area, or I'd start there.

Michael Chu · Joined: 10 May 2005 Posts: 1654 Location: Austin, TX (USA)

Jim Cooley · Joined: 09 Oct 2008 Posts: 377 Location: Seattle

Michael! I tried rendering some leaf lard I got from the butcher's (took 10 days from order to delivery, sigh). I managed to do it, and you're right, the result is SUPERB! None of the off-flavor you mentioned with the Armour.

I did NOT RTFM on renedering before I began, and am rather pissed at the butcher for not offering to grind it for me as he Knew I was going to render it! That's tip #1: Get the butcher to grind it for you!

Second tip is cheesecloth and a big china cap. Both of mine are stored away, so I had to make due with coffee filters and tiny little sieves. Boy, that was pain. Just lots of cheesecloth and a colander would work fine, too.

Thanks again!

Michael Chu · Joined: 10 May 2005 Posts: 1654 Location: Austin, TX (USA)

Jim Cooley · Joined: 09 Oct 2008 Posts: 377 Location: Seattle

Guest · Posted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 5:11 am Post subject: Using Butter in Pastry

Using Butter in Pastry can be tricky because butter may contain liquid, either from milk or water added to make it heavier for sale.

To remove the water you need to melt the butter first then heat it on med/low until it sizzles and turn it down and cook for at least 2 minutes. (Getting it too hot will brown it changing the flavor.)

Let the butter cool completely to use for Pastry, as the harder fat will make nice globules in the flour for that flaky quality. If you are in a hurry you can pour the melted butter onto the flour mixture, wait for it to cool on top, then mix it in, but harder fat is better. (melted butter is ok to use in biscuits and pancakes though.)

Nan B.

Jim Cooley · Joined: 09 Oct 2008 Posts: 377 Location: Seattle

Thanks Nan. Good point.

Guest · Posted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 7:32 pm Post subject:

You are welcome Jim,
but of course the leaf lard is best. Smile

Nik · Guest

hi all
so glad this site is alive and well for the last # years.
lard is wonderful due to the melting point. when it has a 'meaty' smell, that can detract from a mild, non-savory filling, such as a custard. also due to poor handling or rendering method it can even have an 'off' flavor that is extremely off-putting. i'd suggest melting a bit and frying a cube of bread to taste and decide for yourself. i always used lard yrs ago until a family member decided on vegetarianism. now i use trans-free Spectrum shortening (2/3) and unsalted butter (1/3).
cut the butter in first with a small amt of shortening for a fine crumb appearance. finish with the remainder of the shortening cutting it in coarsely to get the much desired flakey effect. yes- too much water will make a tough, cardboardlike crust. my flour often adsorbs 2x as much water as called for !! but just monitor as you go and DO NOT overwork the dough. always chill crust prior to filling. always start baking @ 425 F
regardless of the sort of pie, to set the flakiness. otherwise the fats will simply melt and make another sort of cardboard.
it's a sad, sad pie that is no good hot from the oven. next morning, cold, is the true test of a tasty, flakey crust! thnks for letting me chat. i love pie!