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Recipe File in Disarray

 
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cpoticha



Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 2
Location: The Netherlands

PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2008 4:38 pm    Post subject: Recipe File in Disarray Reply with quote

Is anyone else frustrated by the disorder of the Recipe File?

I started to browse through it, and gave up after less than one minute after I saw the very first listed recipe for tsatziki, filed under "A" for "Anghelika's Tsatsiki".

Then I noticed the Grilled Pork Chops filed under "G", Roast Turkey filed under "C" for "Classic", Chicken and Rice under "O" for "Oven Baked" and Mayonnaise filed under "H" for "Homemade"! Laughing Out Loud Hardly analytical thinking!

Maybe engineers are an even rarer breed than I thought, but most people associate a recipe with the main ingredient (beef, chicken, scallops) or form (soup, cake, burrito); not with a heating method or utensil (grilled, roasted, lovingly-tossed) and certainly not with a cute descriptor like classic, mini, basic or traditional. (Mmm, I feel like something, something MINI tonight! YUMMY!)

The only shining example I saw in the recipe list was, under "C": "Cheesecake, Plain New York Style", while I could debate whether "Cheesecake Cupcakes" should be filed before or after it.

Any suggestions as to how to rationalize this mess?
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Dilbert



Joined: 19 Oct 2007
Posts: 1006
Location: central PA

PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2008 6:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

well, as most any user - engineer or not - has experienced, "message board" (in the most general sense) software is severely lacking when it comes to special needs.

files on record (ie recipes / messages) are sorted / indexed by some field - most likely the title/subject.

it would indeed be nifty if the administrator had a separate field "file under letter:" _" but that's not an available function.
not to mention, somebody has to take the time to do that, and no more to mention there are conflicts in producing a singular indexing category.

is it beef? or roast? or steak? or g for ground beef?
chicken? poultry, Cornish, turkey, tenders?

if everything that was made with beef was in one lump category, it would be equally as unmanageable. and methinks chicken would be worse.

conceptually I agree with your thinking.
in practice there's first an organizational issue and then a software support issue.
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cpoticha



Joined: 23 Feb 2008
Posts: 2
Location: The Netherlands

PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2008 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Dilbert,

I agree on all counts. Most likely the software just files the items under 'Title' or some such field, alphabetically. But it isn't really necessary to have a separate field to work around this.

It seems to me that the best course would be to develop a logical recipe-naming policy which avoids the problems inherent in English word-order (putting the adjectives before the nouns). Once this is agreed upon, it may be fairly easy to administer and enforce.

Think of the nomenclature which large institutions routinely apply. Subjects, descriptions and titles are arranged from general to specific for easy filing and identification. The Meal, Ready-to-Eat (as opposed to a Ready-to-Eat Meal), is just one example. Shoes, black with rubber soles (slightly worn) is another.

A similar device is used in most recipe ingredient lists as well, though I'm not certain of the reason. "1 Onion, chopped" and "3/4 c Flour, sifted". I suspect this is just for easy reading, but that's the essence of the problem here, isn't it?

I realize, though, that it's probably the intention of the site's founders that people search for recipes, avoiding the clumsy process of browsing through the poorly-organized list. But until the content of the recipe archive becomes encyclopedic, I imagine this would result in plenty of disappointing "no matches found" results. I also see that there really aren't so many recipes in the list that one is burdened by the disarray. But what if the site actually becomes successful? What if there were hundreds of recipes? I suppose the answer is: Better software.

That's my analysis.
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Michael Chu



Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 1619
Location: Austin, TX (USA)

PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 2:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have been struggling with this for the last couple years - how to name the recipes so they are easily located. For example, early on, I just wrote the articles and named them whatever made sense. Then I switched the name of the recipe first (Cheesecake - New York Style) but that felt like it was really unsatisfying as a title for the article. So, I've since switched back to comfortable to read titles for the articles. I have a master index thing in the works, but it's been put on the back burner - especially since this week was spent getting the server migration at Fanpop working fully and recovering from the hard drive failure here at CFE.

Don't forget that I'm only one guy and I'm doing what I can. (Although, it seems to take longer and longer to do anything as I get busier and busier)

Michael
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Dilbert



Joined: 19 Oct 2007
Posts: 1006
Location: central PA

PostPosted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

conceptually correct, but:

Shoes, black with rubber soles
aka Footwear, dark, . . .

Meal, Ready-to-Eat
aka Foodstuff, nonperishable, inedible . . .

(I've look for stuff in the GSA catalog and it's amazing the terminology "large institutions routinely apply")

one could employ four or five librarians and computer scientists to perfect a scheme and monitor every post - and I'll guarantee someone will not be able to find what they are looking for.

better software is a good thing - a search engine that would look at dish name and/or ingredients and/or dish type would be nice, doesn't exist. there is a long standing issue in the cooking community with how to "automatically" recognize amounts and units definitions of even a single line ingredient.

basically every recipe posted would have to be manually input into a standardized format. If you have the time, I'm sure Michael would be happy to chat about it.

once all that effort has been made, realize that the "standardized" recipe has to be posted in addition to the original submission or a whole bunch of people will get very upset at having the posts edited.

not an easy nut to crack.
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Guest
Guest





PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 5:33 am    Post subject: Alphabetical recipes Reply with quote

Just looking for some bread stuff - the baguette discussion actually - and went to the recipe file - then realised I'd have to look at every recipe name because they are not in a standard format.

I was the one who grizzled about the non SI units - now you have a converter - and it would be great if Cream of Mushroom soup was - say - Mushroom Soup, cream, and Grilled pork Chops was Pork Chops, grilled - then you could find them...

Otherwise all great...
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BigWayne



Joined: 30 Nov 2009
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 12:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any time spent on this should be on the search capabilities. No amount of planning on categorization will ever work as people inherently think differently. What makes perfect logical sense to one person will be asinine to another.

BTW - The forum search works well when using the + or AND options, but does not seem to take quoted phrases, but rather ignores the quotes. That would be something nice to have working.
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scole456



Joined: 05 Dec 2011
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 8:48 am    Post subject: recipe file Reply with quote

What about making a separate index and basing it on a standard cookbook? Then link the recipes to the index. I know nothing about computer programming, so don't know the problems entailing a cross index. If you cross index, you wouldn't need to mess with the posts because they'd stay with the recipe & you wouldn't need to rewrite the recipes because they haven't gone anywhere. Then, whoever is in charge of this board could get notified when new recipes get posted and cross index them once a week (or month).
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