Cooking For Engineers Forum Index Cooking For Engineers
Analytical cooking discussed.
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Recipe File: Turkey or Chicken Stock
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Cooking For Engineers Forum Index -> Comments Forum
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Dilbert



Joined: 19 Oct 2007
Posts: 1026
Location: central PA

PostPosted: Sat Nov 29, 2008 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

..pan drippings

yes you can use these - but be aware "solids" in a stock can make it cloudy.

depending on personal preferences and how you eventually use the stock, this may not be an issue at all.
pan drippings usually have a fair amount of fat in them, that should float up and be skimmed off.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Michael Chu



Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 1635
Location: Austin, TX (USA)

PostPosted: Mon Dec 01, 2008 6:00 am    Post subject: Re: Turkey stock Reply with quote

Big Dog wrote:
I am going to make turkey stock in the morning. I would like to know if the pan drippings
from the bird can be used? They have been in the fridge and seem to have gelatinized.

Yes, you can add the turkey drippings to the broth you make with the left over bones.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Guest






PostPosted: Mon Dec 29, 2008 7:19 pm    Post subject: Tampopo ramen! Reply with quote

Your recipe is great. I've used it for chicken stock, and I am about to use it for turkey stock. But as an aside, what I really wanted to mention is how freakin' awesome you are for mentioning the movie "Tampopo". It's fantastic, and hilarious.
Back to top
Guest






PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2009 7:20 pm    Post subject: first time making stock Reply with quote

hi michael,
i love your site! i'm a newbie in the kitchen and trying to learn the basics. i roasted a 7lb chicken last night and saved the carcass, skin, giblets and all the leftover bones. i have been trying to figure out how to make stock and what parts of the chicken i'll need. some stock recipes call for the giblets. why don't you use them? would you use the skin? also since i have a bigger sized chicken do i need to use more carrots, celery and onions? is there a certain ration of "bird" to veggies? and lastly can you explain why you would reduce the stock down? what does that mean when i got to use it in a recipe later on? do i need to add water to it?
i know i'm totally overanalyzing this, but it would help me tremendously to know the background. thanks!
Back to top
Michael Chu



Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 1635
Location: Austin, TX (USA)

PostPosted: Mon Jan 12, 2009 11:12 pm    Post subject: Re: first time making stock Reply with quote

Anonymous wrote:
i have been trying to figure out how to make stock and what parts of the chicken i'll need. some stock recipes call for the giblets. why don't you use them? would you use the skin? also since i have a bigger sized chicken do i need to use more carrots, celery and onions? is there a certain ration of "bird" to veggies? and lastly can you explain why you would reduce the stock down? what does that mean when i got to use it in a recipe later on? do i need to add water to it?

I usually use the giblets for gravy. You can certainly use them in the stock along with the skin. I'd probably brown all the meat and skin first in a pan before adding it to the stock to promote flavor. I don't think you'll need to adjust the vegetables (that's something for you to experiment with in the future).

I reduce the stock for storage purposes. It's also really really good as an undiluted soup (just add a little salt and pepper when heating it for soup) since the gelatin content is so high. So "regular" broth applications you can either use it full strength (for more flavor) or dilute with water (up to your discretion). Since broths often taste different (homemade vs. bought - brand vs. brand), the specific taste will be different if you use full strength vs. diluted, but again you'll need to experiment to see what taste you prefer.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Terri Tepper
Guest





PostPosted: Sun Mar 22, 2009 4:46 pm    Post subject: Turkey Stock Reply with quote

Thanks for this site. It's very helpful. Why do recipes for making stock suggest you keep the lid off? Is there an advantage to having to keep adding water? Wouldn't keeping the lid on keep the liquid from evaporating? Some recipes call for keeping the lid off a crack. Why not leave the lid on completely?

Thanks,
Terri
Back to top
Michael Chu



Joined: 10 May 2005
Posts: 1635
Location: Austin, TX (USA)

PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2009 2:53 am    Post subject: Re: Turkey Stock Reply with quote

Terri Tepper wrote:
Thanks for this site. It's very helpful. Why do recipes for making stock suggest you keep the lid off? Is there an advantage to having to keep adding water? Wouldn't keeping the lid on keep the liquid from evaporating? Some recipes call for keeping the lid off a crack. Why not leave the lid on completely?

I can't speak for other recipes, but I keep the lid off because it's easier to keep the stock from boiling (which can break up too much material and result in a cloudy broth).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
The Brutal Gourmet
Guest





PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 10:36 pm    Post subject: Stock Reply with quote

I have been making my own stocks for years, and cannot recommend it enough. I usually buy whole chickens and butcher them myself since I like my stock to have raw bones, but I have also worked with pre-roasted poultry, beef and lamb bones to wonderful effect. In my experience, there is no amount of roasting which leaves an edible product and still excludes good stock making. Whole chickens are also very cost effective when you do not throw out large portions of them unused.

I usually put just the poultry in the pot and simmer it for an hour. Then I pull the solids out, pick the bones clean and return them to the pot. Then I make a chicken salad sandwich and save the rest of the meat in ziploc bags for adding to soup, or enchiladas, or whatever. Once the clean bones are back in the pot I add the aromatics: herbs, carrots, onion and celery. 7-11 hours later, I pour it through a fine sieve, chill asap and freeze in 1/2 cup, 1 cup and 3 cup pieces (for sauces, soups and risoto as needed). For the smaller increments I use 9 oz plastic cups which I freeze and then store in large ziploc bags until needed.

As for clarifying stock: If I am making Chinese soups (which traditionally call for a very clear stock) I will clarify them with 4 egg whites per 5 cups of stock (yes, that is a lot. I rarely bother, but if I am going to be presenting my final product to someone critical, it is what works). After chilling and skimming the fat from your stock, whip your egg whites to a frothy but less than peaked state. Stir them gently into your chilled, defatted stock. Slowly bring your stock to a simmer, and simmer for ~30 minutes. Then pour it through at least a cheesecloth-lined collander, or if you want crazily clear stock, pour it through a paper coffee filter. It tastes about the same so like I said I rarely bother. Very pretty though.

I also find that if I add about 1/4 to 1/2 of the salt I would expect to use in any recipe, the flavor of the stock holds up better in the long term. If you add no salt at all, I tend to find subtle skunky flavors after long-term freezing (6 months or more, not that that happens often), but a teaspoon or so of kosher salt per quart heads that off.

Finally, Mr. Chu: I have been reading your site for some time and it kicks all kinds of ass. Kudos, and I hope you carry on.
Back to top
The Brutal Gourmet



Joined: 29 Mar 2009
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 11:13 pm    Post subject: One more detail... Reply with quote

I cannot stress enough the importance of using good water in your stock making. There is a certain amount of concentration involved, and if you use tap water which tastes like crap, your stock will taste like concentrated crap. I am fortunate in that my city takes some pains to provide good tap water, but if yours does not you should definitely use bottled water. After all, the vast majority of your final product is the water you used...

This may even be more true for stock than it is for home-brewed beer, which has a fairly insane amount of stuff added to it in the form of sugars, oils and other good stuff.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Guest






PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 10:27 pm    Post subject: No mention of an immersion chiller?! Reply with quote

All these comments from engineers, many on the subject of how to cool down your broth, and not one mention of an immersion chiller?! Are there no brewers here? For those of you not familiar with this piece of equipment, an immersion chiller is basically a big coil of copper tubing. You connect one end to your faucet via a hose, and run a hose from the other end to the drain, then you immerse the coil in the liquid you want to cool, and run cold water through it. The temperature drops crazy fast (to get technical about it).

If you were really nuts, you'd use a counterflow chiller, but that might be a bit much for stock...
Back to top
The Brutal Gourmet



Joined: 29 Mar 2009
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Sun May 03, 2009 5:41 pm    Post subject: Immersion chiller Reply with quote

You make a good point. I generally would not use my beer chiller for stock though, just because the amount of fat involved would make it hard to clean. I love chicken fat, and I love my beer, but I don't much want to mix them (despite the classic recipe in the Modern Homebrewer's Bible for beer made with a whole chicken -- don't blame me, it was not my idea...). I am just not so concerned about the speed with which my stock cools to go quite so far as to contaminate my beer equipment with it. I never use my stock without boiling it first, so it is really excess prudence to chill it super quickly. Not that that is a bad thing, mind you...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jpatti
Guest





PostPosted: Thu Aug 13, 2009 4:51 am    Post subject: other stock ideas Reply with quote

Broth is a big part of my cooking.

I keep a large tupperware in the freezer, so whenever I am chopping onions, garlic, celery, etc, I put all the scraps and peelings in there for making stock. Also, whenever something looks like it might "go" (celery that's gotten soft, for example, but nothing actually *bad*).

I always add a glug of vinegar to extract more goodness from the bones.

There are only two of us I cook for regularly, so often I have small batches of bones to make stock with. When that is the case, I make it in the crockpot as it's easier to do small batches without having to watch to keep the water level up. Throw it in, turn it on, cover and come back whenever it's convenient to do so, doesn't matter if it's 6 hours or 12.

For turkey stock, I don't bother with a stockpot. After Thanksgiving dinner, I cut the leftovers off the carcass, and put the roasting pan on TWO burners of my stove, add water and veggies, and make the stock right in it, with all the leftover drippings and whatnot. It's very flavorful because you have all the seasonings from the stuffing, etc. And it nearly gels while still hot! We usually have pumpkin pie and coffee several hours after dinner, by the time the cleanup from that is done, the stock is ready to be strained.

For chicken stock, I prefer a whole raw chicken, with the neck and giblets, for the most flavorful broth. I freeze the meat in 2 cup portions to use in recipes calling for cooked chicken (chicken salad, stirfries, casserole type dishes).

Not that I'll "waste" a chicken carcass from a roasted chicken; that gets turned into stock too.

I've found that making it from breasts or wings doesn't work as well, just doesn't taste very good, it's bland.

It works pretty well with leg quarters and since these go on sale for ridiculously cheap prices sometimes (I can pick up a 40lb package for $.29/lb - a stock-making bonanza!), they're great for making a big batch of stock, and again just freezing the meat for recipes.

When I plan to freeze the meat for recipes, I don't want to have to sort through and pick soggy onion peelings and disintegrated celery leaves and whatnot. So what I do is take a big piece of muslin and put all the veggies in it, tie if off, and throw it in the stockpot. That simplifies the process when the stock is done, you only have to sort through the meat and bones.

For beef broth, I always roast the bones first. If I've slow roasted short ribs, the leftover bones get used to make stock. If I'm just planning to make stock, I roast shank bones, then scoop the marrow into the liquid. To me, the flavor when you've roasted the bones first is much improved with beef stocks. This doesn't gel as well as the other broths, but is yummy.

I've never yet had enough ham bones to just make stock; I only do a whole ham once or twice a year. The stock gets made immediately into one of several soups I just love and canned.

When doing big batches at once, I either freeze stock in square quart containers (they use freezer space better than round ones) or can it in quart jars. I've never considered storing in smaller batches because there's no way I won't go through a quart in a few days anyways.

I have a quart or two of stock in my fridge all the time, I prefer it to water for cooking brown rice, beans, kasha, small pastas, etc.

I also just heat a cup to drink a few times a week. It makes a nice hot drink, a change from just coffee and tea all the time.

I also make "instant" soup by putting a cup of broth and any random leftover meat or veggies or grain in a big mug and nuking it.

Broth is just awesome stuff.
Back to top
chef
Guest





PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 3:12 am    Post subject: why cool your stock and roasted vs non roasted bones Reply with quote

You cool your stock down in an ice bath to prevent food borne bacteria from multiplying to unsafe levels. You have six hours to cool your stock to 41 degrees or less. Bacteria goes fastest between 125 and 70 degrees, in fact it double by division every twenty min in that temperature range. Your refrigerator was not designed to cool foods just to keep cold foods cold. So foods placed into a fridge without proper cooling can remain in the danger zone for days allowing for dangerous levels of bacteria.

The difference between roasting your bones or not is related to the finished color of the stock. A roasted bone stock is called a brown stock and non roasted stock is called a white stock. Both are good but have different uses in the kitchen.
Back to top
davidwat
Guest





PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 2:42 am    Post subject: Cooling stock? Reply with quote

Stock simmered for several hours covered should be virtually sterile. It certainly won't have any of the Salmonella associated with industrial poultry production. If you bring it back to a simmer after straining, you could then cool it down, covered and unmolested; and put it into ziplock bags for freezing with minimal risk of bacterial contamination. I have cooled it on the patio before.
Back to top
Guest
Guest





PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2010 10:33 pm    Post subject: Stock Reply with quote

HYPER FLAVORFUL & NUTRITIONAL STOCK:

After simmering stock 6-14 hours I add more herbs (1-2 tsp: thyme, parslely, powdered poultry seasoning; 1/2 tsp pepper, 1/2 tsp tumeric) and simmer for another 15 - 20 minutes. This is to retain the maximum flavor of the herbs which begins to boil off after this time (aromatic oils are very fragile and boil off easily). Of course, this can be done when making soups from the stock.

The pot is covered during the simmering process so that the aromatic oils from the seasonings are not lost and condense back into the stock. Some people actually use condenser lids (lids in which ice can be placed) in order to achieve maximum condensation of aromatics which are nutritious and very flavorful.

Vinegar (1 T) and/or lemon juice (I add both), and I have read even parsley, all facilitate the removal of calcium from the bones in addition to the first two significantly enhancing the flavors of the stock. The lemon juice will also remove calcium from the shells of simmered poultry egg shells. Though, most store bought chicken egg shells have been washed in toxic chemicals. Simmer 8-17 hours, stirring every hour to half hour.


Optional - I add a little tumeric (1 tsp) to yellow the stock. This is very traditional. Peppercorns (berperine) will facilitate the absorption of most of the healthy elements from the tumeric. Tumeric can have an odd flavor if too much is added.

Adding dulse will hyper boost the mineral content and, adding powdered poultry seasoning will wow with flavor (sage, thyme, onion, cumin, marjoram, celery seed, pepper, red pepper).

I do not remove all of the fat from the stock because fat facilitates the absorption of some nutritional elements (e.g., fat soluble vitamins A, D, E, K). So, if you were to add vegetables to the stock for a soup, simmer a bit, you would absorb more of these vitamins. In addition, FAT is THE FLAVOR ENHANCER of any dish.
Back to top
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Cooking For Engineers Forum Index -> Comments Forum All times are GMT
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8  Next
Page 4 of 8

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You can reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You can delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group